Testimonies

Testimonies

• 615.

  You do not know who ordered them at all ? – No.

• 616.

  Do you know that they were supplied ? – I think they were supplied.

• 617.

  Is T. Rose a voter ? – Yes, he is a voter.

• 618.

  Is Hunter a voter ? – That is Mrs. Hunter again, the lady to whom the committee room belongs.

• 619.

  Is her husband alive ? – No, she is a widow.

• 620.

  Is Guest a voter ? – Yes.

• 621.

  And is Grey a voter ? – Yes.

• 622.

  You know nothing about it, beyond the claim being sent in ? – No.

• 623.

  Then fly hire and conveyance, 10L. 18s. ? – Yes, the other 5L. in the first account was for sundry FLYS, which I had paid, but it has since been taken off.

• 624.

  Then four CARRIAGES upon the day of the election, 1L. 6s. each ? – That is the whole day, and tie others were FLYS at various times, I suppose. That is a widow woman, so that there could be no object in giving money there. There was a small bill to Wingham of 15s., which has not been paid, which was to convey a freeman from Preston to Sandwich. That is included in the 5L., that I just now said has been taken out.

• 625.

  There is no detail of the 5L. ? – No, not at all, it has been left out altogether ; it was put down as something to indemnify against the sundry FLYS.

• 626.

  No account of from whom they were had, or anything about them ? – No, it came out of my pocket, whatever it was.

• 627.

  Did you pay anyone that 5L. ? – Yes, I believe I did ; if I was in Deal and missed the train, I had a fly.

• 628.

  (Mr. Turner.) Did you pay anybody the 5L. ? – I paid it in small sums. The 5L. was put down to indemnify the sundry FLYS.

• 629.

  (Mr. Holl.) A fly taken for yourself, for instance ? – Yes, it was a sum put in to indemnify and to reimburse me.

• 630.

  Then posting, 4L. ; that has been paid. Was that for posting bills at Sandwich ? – Yes.

• 631.

  That is paid to Gray ; is that the same Gray we had just now ? – No, quite a different man, a bill poster.

• 632.

  Is he a voter ? – Yes.

• 633.

  He seems to have been paid 5s. a day ; surely he would not go posting fresh bills every day ? – Yes, I think very likely.

• 634.

  May 12th, 13th, 14th, and 15th, 5s. each day, and so it goes on from the 12th to the 20th ? – No doubt he can account for every occasion where he went with bills. There was a great deal of bill posting.

• 635.

  I should have thought you would have had your bills posted one day, and done with it ? – No, they were constantly coming out.

• 636.

  Where there are a great many, of course I can understand it, but where you have such a small quantity as 5s. a day, I do not see why it could not be done all at one time ? – There was a good deal.

• 637.

  Then 25L. for out-voters, what is that ? – It was an estimate that was put down for freemen who were residing in various parts of England, some residing in London. Two of those were paid, and the others have not been paid ; but in making out the account in the first instance, we estimated what would be a reasonable charge to reimburse the men the railway expenses, because we could not get the railway passes. There was a man of the name of Nash, a freeman, who lived at Middlesboro’, I had no communication with him before the election, but after the poll he came to me and said he wished to return home, and would I give him his expenses. Of course I was aware that he ought to have had a railway pass, and said at once it was irregular, but I asked him what his expenses came to, and he said 5L., and I paid him 5L. I paid Nash and Smith, but all the others have not been paid. Smith came from Essex. Nash is a highly respectable upholsterer living at Middlesboro’, and beyond any tampering. His father was living at Sandwich. He always has voted in the Liberal interest and came up and gave his vote.

• 638.

  Was there any promise to pay his expenses previously ? – No, I had no communication of any kind with him at all.

• 639.

  And it was paid after the election was over ? – Yes, the very same day.

• 640.

  There was no previous bargain ? – No, none whatever.

• 641.

  With regard to Smith ? – He was the same. Formerly he was a shipwright in Sandwich, and came up and presented himself at the election, and after he had voted he had 3L. for his expenses.

• 642.

  Was there any communication with him previously ? – I think he was asked to come and vote, but I do not think there was any promise with regard to his expenses, or anything of the kind. Those are the only two who have been paid.

• 643.

  3L. would be a great deal more than his fare from Essex ? – Yes ; I suppose it would not be more than 2L.

• 644.

  A first-class return ticket would not be more than 25s. ? – Upon the moment you have no time to look at the actual fare.